Astvox got rights to rebrand Vicidial ?

[joylovebasu]

Astvox dot org got rights to rebrand Vicidial ?

They even changed everything , including logo and

Brought to you by vicidial TO Brought to you by astvox dot org ..

Pl comments...

[mflorell]

Of course they could fork it if they want, but they still need to retain all of the attributions to the ViciDial project since they don't have ownership of the code.

But they don't have any content on their site so I can't confirm anything.

[joylovebasu]

They have REMOVED vicidial name form their entire project and renamed those to astvox as if they have developed the dialer...

[mflorell]

Please send evidence of this to us and I will be happy to send them a cease and desist letter.

Do you know what country they are based in?

[joylovebasu]

Hyderabad , India

[mflorell]

Oh well, not much we can do in India. I've tried contacting the authorities there a few times before and noone is interested in helping you unless you pay them thousands of dollars up front. I read a very interesting account from one ethical developer of how the majority of developers and companies in India will take open source projects and repackage them as their own and charge license fees per seat.

That is not to say all Indian developers are like this, I have met many that are very honest in what they do. But the majority of knockoff ViciDial distributions come from India and there seems to be noone willing to take them on and stop them.

[emailbhatia]

I believe the only way is to give the right (wrong) publicity to these solutions.
You can post information on callcentersindia net and dialerwar wordpress blog and other such forums which are popular.

As far as Matts concern on IP rights in India you are right. Just does not work there.

Cheers!
Sachin

[williamconley]

Perhaps a wiki page with the known knockoffs (ip locked not to be editable from India of course) so Google can help out and bring their clients in. I wonder if they are breaking any Fraud regulations in India?

If so, the coolest part would be if they could be forced BY THEIR CUSTOMERS to return all the money ... in which case anyone doing it would simply be living on borrowed time ...

[Op3r]

I think vicidial.de used to have that info.

then I got into a word war with somebody with that

but yes, I think thats a good idea.

Let me go look for the cache of that site then also post it on my blog. (blatant advertising )

[williamconley]

actually, just a forum topic here would do it quite nicely. this forum comes up quite reliably on Google.

[mflorell]

Here's the original list from that site, we are working on a new vicidial.org site so hopefully this will go up there as well:


You might be using Vicidial without knowing it
A number of companies have re-branded Vicidial on their own and while some of them are acknowledging VICIDIAL and offering their code as a download, we call them "VICIDIAL Rebranded vendors"(see the list at the bottom of this page), some others are not disclosing their source or contributing back to the community. Some of them even sell Vicidial, or what ever they call it, as their own creation even though they often lack the expertise to properly troubleshoot their systems or do other high-level work on the VICIDIAL source code. We know of very bad experiences their customers had from many of these "VICIDIAL knockoff vendor" companies.

If you should encounter a company offering VICIDIAL under a different name that is not listed here yet, please let us know.

Some of the "VICIDIAL knockoff vendors" companies offer special add-ons but did not contribute them back to the community.

Since they can only release their creation under the GPL or fully break the law, it would be nice if one of their customers would make use of their right to redistribute the source of these add-ons. If you need help with that please contact us!

Besides the cost, there are a number of reasons why you should not use any of these "VICIDIAL knockoff vendors" companies:

Usually once they rebranded the system you are cut of from all further VICIDIAL development, since they these vendors will not want to spend the time and money to follow each new release.
You most likely will not get timely security fixes.
Most companies will only deliver the truncated Manuals (even breaking the copyright on these)
You are not taking part in the support community, since solutions from original ViciDial are not always directly applicable.

Here are some "VICIDIAL knockoff vendors" examples for sites that try to pass Vicidial off as their own:

CallSpire - http://www.callspire.com/
also known as telemarketingdialer.com and PBXunlimited, frequently sells on ebay

CallMyWay - http://www.callmyway.com/

entVoice Call Center - http://support.enterux.net/index.php

SlashVox Dialer - http://www.voicefidelity.net/

MegaDial - http://www.tooldialer.com/

Call Magic - http://www.panamaxil.com/

Likvidor - http://www.likvidor.se/predictive-dialer.php
Contaque - http://www.contaque.com/Product/PredictiveDialer/

ContactIP - http://www.ccsnl.com/product.html

Fintech Call Center - http://www.fintechcommunications.com/se ... enter.html

Freedom Telework Virtual Call Center - http://freedomtelework.com/index-solutions.php

NG-PBX Call Center from Linq - http://www.linqone.com/NG-PBX/Call-Center.html

SoftDial Predictive Dialer - http://www.softdial.biz/index.php?disp=0997

Konnect Infotech Predictive Dialer - http://www.konnectinfotech.com/products.htm

Mortgage Dialer - http://www.mortgagedialer.com/features.html

1bizcom(Adiance Call Center) - http://www.adiance.com/voipcallcenter.html
Used to offer source download, then they pulled the project site. Product still posted on their company website as acive though.



Here is the list of companies doing "Rebranded VICIDIAL" the right way:

NextCCS - http://www.nextix.org/nextixsystems/

digiCONTACTS - http://www.sdci.fr/digicontacts.html

DialPrix - http://www.packet-shaper.com/product/pd.html

[joylovebasu]

Call Magic - http://www.panamaxil.com/

As per them , they did for Indian Railways

[devafree]

Hello
Regarding violations in India,

I think the way to go for it is you can get to sue a violator in court and get an injunction ; not sure about the damages (money compensation). Talking to authorities will do no good, in my opinion. Those who purchased from these vendors can also sue, as can the original creator/s.

The thing is it will take several years, though an interim injunction can be obtained with immediate effect if the suit is well planned and can be enforced till the final disposal of the case/s. Also, I am sure multiple parties can be sued all together. Also, there are ways to injunct the key people from replicating the violation through other persons / entities.

I will give more inputs after talking to lawyers in the IP (intellectual property) area.

Regards
devafree

[williamconley]

i think that what you are missing here is that this "sue" process would take years, cost lots of money and likely have no actual effect, since the offender would simply rename and do it again.

The problem is that Vicidial presently has no "Corporate Presence" in India. Until someone volunteers to "sue" on Vicidial's behalf, it simply isn't feasible.

Although I will say that negotiations with The Vicidial Group could undoubtedly be had (but do not quote me on that, of course, as I am NOT The Vicidial Group, the owners of the copyright/trademark), they would not likely involve any form of remuneration until AFTER the completion of the lawsuit and payment by the offender (and would likely be a %age of the results, perhaps as much as 99%!).

[devafree]

Hello

i think that what you are missing here is that this "sue" process would take years, cost lots of money and likely have no actual effect, since the offender would simply rename and do it again.

Well, first off I think only the suing process can be effective . It can be made immediately effective , if the copyright holder succeeds in 2 things (1) Getting an Interim injunction - immediately effective (2) ability to track new avatars, if any of the offending person / company , this makes them guilty of contempt of the court order , the penalties for this can be very steep. 930 also, i think it may be possible to get a order immediately effective agaisnt all violaters, whether they have been sued yet or not. Although the question of proof lies open, it will be a lesser burden for future cases.

Plus, I think a publicity drive will be in order , maybe we can safely defame the offenders, within legal limits . More on the positive side, i think many call centers are not really aware of vicidial still and less aware about GPL / AGPL concepts. Newspapers will be glad to have some interesting articles on this, i am sure.

Regarding costs, we can get an estimate. I know that a past president of the Free Software Foundation of Chennai Chapter is a well known lawyer (and hobbyist programmer!), they may be willing to lend their ears and aid. I will find out more, and also give a cost estimate. Since the compensation is not fixed, the actual court costs will be nominal , like a couple hundred dollars only max. So, its the lawyers' fee that has to be sought to be minimized or sponsored.

Regards,
devafree

[williamconley]

I understand, but having experienced the chase myself, I can see why The Vicidial Group may shy from even a couple hundred dollar. Since the violator would likely immediately disappear and rename.

A couple hundred dollars chasing a ghost can add up very quickly. (Same guy, three or four ghosts a year ... without actually "getting" them ...?)

Not to mention, the main "Plus" is that it's a public service, since ordinarily these thieves are charging thousands of dollars to an unsuspecting client and then leaving without providing the service. So the true money losers are the clients, and the culprit is ordinarly Long Gone before their identity actually surfaces.

So spending a couple hundred dollars a shot to convince a theif to disappear with someone else's money ... well, I'm not sure anyone is ready for that.

On the other hand, the next time my father visits India, I may have him "pay some visits", since this may result in an ACTUAL identification, instead of a "virtual" catch.

Now, if the group in question were willing to do it on a "get paid if you collect basis" ... there may be some value in that. I wonder if there are any international "ambulance chasers" that would handle Intellectual Property Rights the way lawyers in the US handle Personal Injury. THAT would be cool.